From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 6A1E013873B for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2014 19:26:31 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id D7DF6E0AD6; Mon, 3 Mar 2014 19:26:25 +0000 (UTC) Received: from qmta11.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net (qmta11.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net [76.96.27.211]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id 1419CE0AD1 for ; Mon, 3 Mar 2014 19:26:24 +0000 (UTC) Received: from omta20.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net ([76.96.30.87]) by qmta11.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id Z2jp1n0011smiN4AB7SQnw; Mon, 03 Mar 2014 19:26:24 +0000 Received: from crud.chemoelectric.org ([66.41.30.59]) by omta20.emeryville.ca.mail.comcast.net with comcast id Z7SN1n00V1GXozm8g7SPo4; Mon, 03 Mar 2014 19:26:24 +0000 Received: by crud.chemoelectric.org (Postfix, from userid 1501) id DF80E205024B6; Mon, 3 Mar 2014 13:26:22 -0600 (CST) Date: Mon, 3 Mar 2014 13:26:22 -0600 From: Barry Schwartz To: gentoo-amd64@lists.gentoo.org Subject: Re: [gentoo-amd64] Please get me straight about sysvinit vs. systemd, udev vs eudev vs mdev, virtuals and other things... Message-ID: <20140303192622.GA11989@crud> References: <5314B8C6.3040803@libertytrek.org> <20140303131242.5cb4eb9a6e0128e678d12a92@comcast.net> <20140303141044.a39135a353f02757254832f3@comcast.net> Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-amd64@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-amd64@lists.gentoo.org MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit In-Reply-To: <20140303141044.a39135a353f02757254832f3@comcast.net> User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15) DKIM-Signature: v=1; a=rsa-sha256; c=relaxed/relaxed; d=comcast.net; s=q20121106; t=1393874784; bh=XVLt7Qi/6YA/TjSnLcGUVk9+hxM4W6H3NMm0QHoQ6ZM=; h=Received:Received:Received:Date:From:To:Subject:Message-ID: MIME-Version:Content-Type; b=QVDoi+McFBBDe0VTc8KUS+OPpgvBSuyCG/8V9PRzTCrDXlABIxqBh/GKrCh1RNQRf QYTTtyi7DacugIGZnEVThWu0JzOhkothGdng6tNcFqBgx+yiu2nxajIrNMzYwdrCEa 8WVpY7V7+6tvOImW6VxOkxsD1m3rOpu3CVuAqv7agEIPSCFZV4CAZcZOY62dZOsx7E 3YD69awpfJmY3Ck0vAU/1W1QfmpK+auqCvqgVEXeFyIoDDZSjsdISB1Plp0AIDKJ62 +XqFXNvF7+kZuMmoDl939NgjhazzveViEK2ojv230GIDuoNPfw9d2pEz7XAQpuRD4H Jv7Wus2l2auxA== X-Archives-Salt: 23849772-a6d0-441b-a2aa-50b14399c7fa X-Archives-Hash: c0aba68d4d50ca50a97d88af0a457704 Frank Peters skribis: > I hope that you are right, but when I see distributions like "Linux > From Scratch," which purport to give the user total understanding > and control of his system, not including alternatives to udev I begin > to have serious doubts. Having built LFS and CLFS systems, I can say the process is not very informative, at least not anymore. It is basically like those old Radio Shack electronics kits where they told you what to solder where, but you still were given very little if any idea how the device worked. Stick udev here, stick pam there, etc. What you _do_ learn is (a) how to bootstrap a Linux OS from another Linux OS (in a bit more detail than you learn with modern Gentoo) and (b) how to use GNU Autotools much more effectively. This is like learning how to solder, but not like learning electronics. I do not see what is so difficult to understand about our position. Imagine if Gentoo started requiring that you use a generic kernel, because upstream software no longer worked if you configured your own kernel. You’d still be getting free-as-in-beer software, but effectively you would have lost some of your liberty.