[gentoo-amd64] musicbrainz

[gentoo-amd64] musicbrainz

[Paul Stear]

Hi,
Sorry to bother you but I am missing the use of musicbrainz in amarok 1.4.0 
using kde 3.5.2 on an amd64 platform.
When will we get it back?
If it's a question of testing I would like to volunteer my services (as a 
user).
kind regards
Paul
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] musicbrainz

[Adam James]

On Tue, 3 Oct 2006 09:46:30 +0100 Paul Stear <gentoo@appjaws.plus.com>
wrote:

Hello,

> Sorry to bother you but I am missing the use of musicbrainz in amarok
> 1.4.0 using kde 3.5.2 on an amd64 platform.

See http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=140184 for justification of
libtunepimp's removal from the portage tree.

> When will we get it back?

You could be waiting for some time, at least until the ebuild maintainer
is happy with the responsiveness of upstream. Not breaking API
compatibility with every 0.x release would also help!

-- Adam
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] musicbrainz

[Boyd Stephen Smith Jr.]

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On Tuesday 03 October 2006 03:46, Paul Stear <gentoo@appjaws.plus.com> 
wrote about '[gentoo-amd64] musicbrainz':
> Sorry to bother you but I am missing the use of musicbrainz in amarok
> 1.4.0 using kde 3.5.2 on an amd64 platform.
> When will we get it back?

See my post in gentoo-user.  Also, I believe it's frowned upon to crosspost 
to multiple gentoo lists.

-- 
"If there's one thing we've established over the years,
it's that the vast majority of our users don't have the slightest
clue what's best for them in terms of package stability."
-- Gentoo Developer Ciaran McCreesh

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[gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?

[Patric Douhane]

Hi, I've recently installed XMMS and it works fine with .ogg files, but 
can't play .flac files. I have "USE" flac in my make.conf. Do I need a 
special plugin or codec, or another program perhaps? 


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Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?

[Daniel Iliev]

Wed, 4 Oct 2006 10:11:45 +0200
"Patric Douhane" <patric@ownit.se>

> Hi, I've recently installed XMMS and it works fine with .ogg files, but 
> can't play .flac files. I have "USE" flac in my make.conf. Do I need a 
> special plugin or codec, or another program perhaps? 
> 
> 

You should have "media-libs/flac" emerged as a dependency. It
provides "/usr/lib64/xmms/Input/libxmms-flac.so" which is used by xmms
as an input plug-in. If you have "media-libs/flac" installed then you
should check if "xmms >> Preferences >> Audio I/O Plugins >> Reference
FLAC Player" is enabled. 


P.S.

It is not polite when someone asks a new question on a thread with
different subject. It is called hijacking and happens when "reply" is
used instead of "new message".


-- 
Best regards,
Daniel

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?

[Conway S. Smith]

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On Wed, 4 Oct 2006 10:11:45 +0200
"Patric Douhane" <patric@ownit.se> wrote:
> Hi, I've recently installed XMMS and it works fine with .ogg files,
> but can't play .flac files. I have "USE" flac in my make.conf. Do I
> need a special plugin or codec, or another program perhaps? 
> 

XMMS can play FLAC files using either the libsndfile or the Reference
FLAC Player input plugins; but in my experience, the libsndfile plugin
takes precedence, but doesn't work properly.  So I disabled the
libsndfile plugin, so the Reference FLAC Player plugin will work.  In
XMMS, open preferences, and on the Audio I/O Plugins tab make sure it
lists the Reference FLAC Player plugin, and that the libsndfile plugin
is disabled or not listed.

Good luck,
Conway S. Smith

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?

[Vladimir G. Ivanovic]

On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 11:49 +0300, Daniel Iliev wrote:

> It is not polite when someone asks a new question on a thread with
> different subject. It is called hijacking and happens when "reply" is
> used instead of "new message".

Agreed, but my mail reader (Evolution) shows his subject to be "How to
play flac files?" which is a new subject. My mail reader shows Patric's
original email to be a sub-thread of a previous email with a different
subject, but I would say that this is a bug in Evolution, not that
hijacking has occurred.

My 2 cents.

--- Vladimir

-- 
Vladimir G. Ivanovic <vgivanovic@comcast.net>


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Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?

[Bo Ørsted Andresen]

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On Wednesday 04 October 2006 18:25, Vladimir G. Ivanovic wrote:
> My mail reader shows Patric's
> original email to be a sub-thread of a previous email with a different
> subject, but I would say that this is a bug in Evolution, not that
> hijacking has occurred.

Huh? It shows as a subthread because of this header:

> References: <200610030946.31015.gentoo@appjaws.plus.com> 
> <200610031443.37094.bss03@volumehost.net> 

Not because of the Subject header...

-- 
Bo Andresen

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Thread-hijacking (was: Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?)

[Boyd Stephen Smith Jr.]

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On Wednesday 04 October 2006 11:25, "Vladimir G. Ivanovic" 
<vgivanovic@comcast.net> wrote about 'Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac 
files?':
> Agreed, but my mail reader (Evolution) shows his subject to be "How to
> play flac files?" which is a new subject. My mail reader shows Patric's
> original email to be a sub-thread of a previous email with a different
> subject, but I would say that this is a bug in Evolution, not that
> hijacking has occurred.

That's the very *definition* of highjacking.  There's a specific header 
('References', IIRC) that is used to indicate what thread a message is 
part of.  This is for various reasons, but mostly because matching subject 
doesn't give you full information about the tree structure of the thread, 
and attempting to match quoted text can lead to madness.

While some mail clients provide subject based threading, it is not the 
correct way to indicate a message is threaded.  Subject-based threading is 
generally only useful to work around mail clients that do not properly add 
a 'References' header (or whatever header you are supposed to use, I don't 
remember, ATM).

-- 
"If there's one thing we've established over the years,
it's that the vast majority of our users don't have the slightest
clue what's best for them in terms of package stability."
-- Gentoo Developer Ciaran McCreesh

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?

[Vladimir G. Ivanovic]

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On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 18:32 +0200, Bo Ørsted Andresen wrote:

> On Wednesday 04 October 2006 18:25, Vladimir G. Ivanovic wrote:
> > My mail reader shows Patric's
> > original email to be a sub-thread of a previous email with a different
> > subject, but I would say that this is a bug in Evolution, not that
> > hijacking has occurred.
> 
> Huh? It shows as a subthread because of this header:
> 
> > References: <200610030946.31015.gentoo@appjaws.plus.com> 
> > <200610031443.37094.bss03@volumehost.net> 
> 
> Not because of the Subject header...


I don't know about you, but I don't look at headers like References. So,
if the subject differ and the mailer says one is a reply to the other, I
consider that a bug.

---- Vladimir

-- 
Vladimir G. Ivanovic <vgivanovic@comcast.net>

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Re: Thread-hijacking (was: Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?)

[Vladimir G. Ivanovic]

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On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 14:28 -0500, Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. wrote:

> On Wednesday 04 October 2006 11:25, "Vladimir G. Ivanovic" 
> <vgivanovic@comcast.net> wrote about 'Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac 
> files?':
> > Agreed, but my mail reader (Evolution) shows his subject to be "How to
> > play flac files?" which is a new subject. My mail reader shows Patric's
> > original email to be a sub-thread of a previous email with a different
> > subject, but I would say that this is a bug in Evolution, not that
> > hijacking has occurred.
> 
> That's the very *definition* of highjacking.  There's a specific header 
> ('References', IIRC) that is used to indicate what thread a message is 
> part of.  This is for various reasons, but mostly because matching subject 
> doesn't give you full information about the tree structure of the thread, 
> and attempting to match quoted text can lead to madness.
> 
> While some mail clients provide subject based threading, it is not the 
> correct way to indicate a message is threaded.  Subject-based threading is 
> generally only useful to work around mail clients that do not properly add 
> a 'References' header (or whatever header you are supposed to use, I don't 
> remember, ATM).
> 

About, oh, 99.9% of the world's email users wouldn't have any idea of
what we're talking about. The notion that emails with different subjects
would be part of the same thread would strike them as, expressing it
politely, interesting.

---- Vladimir

-- 
Vladimir G. Ivanovic <vgivanovic@comcast.net>

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[gentoo-amd64] Re: How to play flac files?

[Duncan]

"Vladimir G. Ivanovic" <vgivanovic@comcast.net> posted
1160018216.12546.1.camel@scarlatti.leonora.org, excerpted below, on  Wed,
04 Oct 2006 20:16:56 -0700:

> I don't know about you, but I don't look at headers like References. So,
> if the subject differ and the mailer says one is a reply to the other, I
> consider that a bug.

I don't normally look at them either, but my client of choice has an
option to thread by subject or by references, and I opt for and strongly
support its references threading feature.  If a post says it's a reply to
another post, that's what it is, even if the subject has changed.  If
someone's replying to a thread with something entirely unconnected (as in,
not natural thread drift, but an abrupt unconnected change), it's thread
hijacking and a "PEBKAC" (problem exists between keyboard and chair, IOW,
the human involved has a bug and he needs called on it so it can be
corrected).  Subject change on the same thread should be due to thread
drift, which is NOT thread hijacking and shouldn't be treated as such, by
separately threading it due only to the subject change.

-- 
Duncan - List replies preferred.   No HTML msgs.
"Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman

-- 
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?

[Boyd Stephen Smith Jr.]

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On Wednesday 04 October 2006 22:16, "Vladimir G. Ivanovic" 
<vgivanovic@comcast.net> wrote about 'Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac 
files?':
> I don't know about you, but I don't look at headers like References. So,
> if the subject differ and the mailer says one is a reply to the other, I
> consider that a bug.

And that would make you wrong according to the relevant standards and RFCs.

Differing subject within the same thread is a *desired feature* of email, 
and has been for a long time.  As has the reverse (different threads w/ 
the same subject).

-- 
"If there's one thing we've established over the years,
it's that the vast majority of our users don't have the slightest
clue what's best for them in terms of package stability."
-- Gentoo Developer Ciaran McCreesh

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Re: Thread-hijacking (was: Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?)

[Boyd Stephen Smith Jr.]

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On Wednesday 04 October 2006 22:23, "Vladimir G. Ivanovic" 
<vgivanovic@comcast.net> wrote about 'Re: Thread-hijacking (was: Re: 
[gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?)':
> About, oh, 99.9% of the world's email users wouldn't have any idea of
> what we're talking about. The notion that emails with different subjects
> would be part of the same thread would strike them as, expressing it
> politely, interesting.

Stupidity, ignorance, and/or apathy are not good reasons for breaking 
thoughtful, long-lived, and useful standards and tradition.  Of course, 
they aren't good reasons for keeping them either.

References transfers the intent of the composer [Reply vs. New Mail] in a 
way that a Subject does not.  As I mentioned in my other email, this is a 
desired feature, not a bug.

-- 
"If there's one thing we've established over the years,
it's that the vast majority of our users don't have the slightest
clue what's best for them in terms of package stability."
-- Gentoo Developer Ciaran McCreesh

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?

[Paul Stear]

On Wednesday 04 October 2006 17:25, Vladimir G. Ivanovic wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 11:49 +0300, Daniel Iliev wrote:
> > It is not polite when someone asks a new question on a thread with
> > different subject. It is called hijacking and happens when "reply" is
> > used instead of "new message".
>
> Agreed, but my mail reader (Evolution) shows his subject to be "How to
> play flac files?" which is a new subject. My mail reader shows Patric's
> original email to be a sub-thread of a previous email with a different
> subject, but I would say that this is a bug in Evolution, not that
> hijacking has occurred.
>
This must be a bug in evolution because I am the user who it appears had his 
subject changed.  My mail was a new mail (not reply to) with a totally 
different subject..

Paul

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?

[Hemmann, Volker Armin]

On Thursday 05 October 2006 05:16, Vladimir G. Ivanovic wrote:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 18:32 +0200, Bo Ørsted Andresen wrote:
> > On Wednesday 04 October 2006 18:25, Vladimir G. Ivanovic wrote:
> > > My mail reader shows Patric's
> > > original email to be a sub-thread of a previous email with a different
> > > subject, but I would say that this is a bug in Evolution, not that
> > > hijacking has occurred.
> >
> > Huh? It shows as a subthread because of this header:
> > > References: <200610030946.31015.gentoo@appjaws.plus.com>
> > > <200610031443.37094.bss03@volumehost.net>
> >
> > Not because of the Subject header...
>
> I don't know about you, but I don't look at headers like References. So,
> if the subject differ and the mailer says one is a reply to the other, I
> consider that a bug.
>
> ---- Vladimir

no, it is the correct behaviour.

The subject is not a good way to determine, that a mail belong in a thread or 
not. RE, Re [RE], {AW}. is only one thing that changes in the subject.

Looking at the header is 'the standard', a mailer not doing it is inherently 
broken.

And taking over threads, because you are too lazy to click on 'new mail' is 
even more broken.

-- 
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[gentoo-amd64] Re: How to play flac files?

[Duncan]

Paul Stear <gentoo@appjaws.plus.com> posted
200610051038.23730.gentoo@appjaws.plus.com, excerpted below, on  Thu, 05
Oct 2006 10:38:23 +0100:

> On Wednesday 04 October 2006 17:25, Vladimir G. Ivanovic wrote:
>> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 11:49 +0300, Daniel Iliev wrote:
>> > It is not polite when someone asks a new question on a thread with
>> > different subject. It is called hijacking and happens when "reply" is
>> > used instead of "new message".
>>
>> Agreed, but my mail reader (Evolution) shows his subject to be "How to
>> play flac files?" which is a new subject. My mail reader shows Patric's
>> original email to be a sub-thread of a previous email with a different
>> subject, but I would say that this is a bug in Evolution, not that
>> hijacking has occurred.
>>
> This must be a bug in evolution because I am the user who it appears had
> his subject changed.  My mail was a new mail (not reply to) with a totally
> different subject..

Your "musicbrainz" post was fine, as the start of a new thread (no
references header, posted using kmail).  It was Patric Douhane's "flac"
post (using MSOE) that was the "hijack" of your thread, new, totally
unrelated topic (flac) and subject header, but posted as a /reply/ to your
(musicbrainz) thread instead of a new post, thus with a references header
likewise indicating that it should be threaded under your post.

According to the above, Evolution is displaying it exactly as it should
(thus it's /not/ a bug), threading the flac subject under the musicbrainz
thread because it cites the musicbrainz posts as up-thread references. 
For all Evolution knows, it was thread drift, and someone simply decided
to retitle the subthread to indicate the drift, not a new thread, because
that's what the references headers indicate, regardless of what the
subject header says.

The clients that are bugged are for example, ones that thread together two
entirely unrelated posts, received years apart from two different people
and without any references headers whatsoever, simply because the subject
line of both is a single word, "test".  I've seen it happen.  Why would
two entirely unrelated posts, no references saying they are related,
posted literally years apart, entirely different authors, even sent to
different receiver addresses on different ISPs (I switched ISPs in the
mean time), end up threaded together simply because the subject is
similar?  It makes no sense!  At least threading together posts where one
is a direct reply to the other according to the references header, makes
sense, even if the human sending the "reply" /should/ have used new-post
instead of reply.

-- 
Duncan - List replies preferred.   No HTML msgs.
"Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman

-- 
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Re: Thread-hijacking (was: Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?)

[Richard Fish]

On 10/4/06, Vladimir G. Ivanovic <vgivanovic@comcast.net> wrote:
>   About, oh, 99.9% of the world's email users wouldn't have any idea of what we're talking about. The notion that emails with different subjects would be part of the same thread would strike them as, expressing it politely, interesting.

Wow!  I had no idea 99.9% of the world's email users were now using gmail! :-P

-Richard
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[gentoo-amd64] Re: Thread-hijacking

[Richard Freeman]

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-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

Richard Fish wrote:
> On 10/4/06, Vladimir G. Ivanovic <vgivanovic@comcast.net> wrote:
>>   About, oh, 99.9% of the world's email users wouldn't have any idea
>> of what we're talking about. The notion that emails with different
>> subjects would be part of the same thread would strike them as,
>> expressing it politely, interesting.
> 
> Wow!  I had no idea 99.9% of the world's email users were now using
> gmail! :-P
> 

Well, if you include hotmail (which doesn't do threading of any kind)
you might be getting close.

On the other hand, if you surveyed the people who actually read this
list, my guess is that the majority are using software that pays
attention to the references header.  I typically use thunderbird, and it
does, and as a result this thread appeared hijacked.

I wish I could keep it from merging identical subjects into the same
thread.  On rare occasion I get emails with no subject from family and
they end up buried in my inbox under another email with a similarly
useless subject line...
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE-----
Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (GNU/Linux)
Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org

iD8DBQFFJlqRG4/rWKZmVWkRAvNRAJ9j/8Fjl/jfb2wVvqJqey3OqY7riwCePX5m
ICPWItXdcNgcNyw18ykeNag=
=O0yU
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] Re: Thread-hijacking

[Conway S. Smith]

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On Fri, 06 Oct 2006 09:30:57 -0400
Richard Freeman <rich@thefreemanclan.net> wrote:
<snip>
> ... I typically use thunderbird ...
> 
> I wish I could keep it from merging identical subjects into the same
> thread.  On rare occasion I get emails with no subject from family and
> they end up buried in my inbox under another email with a similarly
> useless subject line...

I just recently switched from using thunderbird to using
sylpheed-claws, because I found this and a few other behaviors of
thunderbird to not be to my liking. But actually in the process of
migrating stuff from thunderbird to sylpheed-claws, I found the option
to stop thunderbird from threading by subject:
Edit->Preferences->Config Editor, Filter "thread", and change
mail.strict_threading from false to true.  Or at least, that's SUPPOSED
to do it, but like the options to not put the graphical bar by quoted
parts of an email, doesn't actually do anything (at least for me)...

A link: <http://kb.mozillazine.org/Stop_threading_by_subject>


Hope it works for you,
Conway S. Smith

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] Re: Thread-hijacking

[Richard Freeman]

On Fri, 06 Oct 2006 17:02:00 -0600
"Conway S. Smith" <beolach@comcast.net> wrote:

> I just recently switched from using thunderbird to using
> sylpheed-claws, because I found this and a few other behaviors of
> thunderbird to not be to my liking. 

Hmm - doesn't seem too bad (gotta love IMAP - 10 minutes and I'm up and
running).

How is the gpg/smime support?  Obviously your message was signed - does
it prompt for a passphrase or do you need gpg-agent running?  Maybe I
just need to keep tinkering but I don't see any obvious place to select
a signing key (I did find the SSL cert directory - haven't had time to
export/import those).

Grr - encryption must not be ready for prime time - it considered your
message "encrypted" and consequently it wants to encrypt this reply
(rather rude on mailing lists...)  :)
-- 
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] How to play flac files?

[Pawel Kraszewski]

Dnia środa, 4 października 2006 18:25, Vladimir G. Ivanovic napisał:
> On Wed, 2006-10-04 at 11:49 +0300, Daniel Iliev wrote:
> > It is not polite when someone asks a new question on a thread with
> > different subject. It is called hijacking and happens when "reply" is
> > used instead of "new message".
>
> Agreed, but my mail reader (Evolution) shows his subject to be "How to
> play flac files?" which is a new subject. My mail reader shows Patric's
> original email to be a sub-thread of a previous email with a different
> subject, but I would say that this is a bug in Evolution, not that
> hijacking has occurred.

'flac' post has 'References:' field pointing to 'musicbrainz' post. Yes, it IS 
hijacking according to RFC822/RFC2822.

Some programs do threading by 'subject', some by 'references'. The latter is 
IMHO better as it enables [re] [ot] and so on without excessive title parsing 
and doesn't thread independent messages with accidently the same title.

-- 
 Pawel Kraszewski
 www.kraszewscy.net

-- 
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[gentoo-amd64] Sylpheed-claws GPG & S/MIME support (was: Re: Thread-hijacking)

[Conway S. Smith]

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On Fri, 06 Oct 2006 21:27:02 -0400
Richard Freeman <rich@thefreemanclan.net> wrote:
> On Fri, 06 Oct 2006 17:02:00 -0600
> "Conway S. Smith" <beolach@comcast.net> wrote:
> 
> > I just recently switched from using thunderbird to using
> > sylpheed-claws, because I found this and a few other behaviors of
> > thunderbird to not be to my liking. 
> 
> Hmm - doesn't seem too bad (gotta love IMAP - 10 minutes and I'm up
> and running).
> 
> How is the gpg/smime support?  Obviously your message was signed -
> does it prompt for a passphrase or do you need gpg-agent running?
> Maybe I just need to keep tinkering but I don't see any obvious place
> to select a signing key (I did find the SSL cert directory - haven't
> had time to export/import those).
> 

GPG support is good, using the "standard" plugins built by default.  It
does prompt for the passphrase, no need for gpg-agent to be running.
You can choose the GPG key used in Configuration->Edit
Accounts->(Select Account)->Edit->Plugins->GPG.  You can also create a
new key there.

I'm not as familiar with S/MIME, but sylpheed-claws seems to support it
via "extra" plugins, either (in portage)
mail-client/sylpheed-claws-smime or
mail-client/sylpheed-claws-etpan-privacy.
mail-client/sylpheed-claws-smime is missing an amd64 keyword, but seems
to compile & work OK for me, although it does have a note "WARNING:
This plugin doesn't handle sign+encrypt and encryption of multipart
messages very well (yet)." and "This plugin uses the GPGME library as a
wrapper for GnuPG. This plugin also needs gpgsm, gnupg-agent and
dirmngr installed and configured."  So that plugin is maybe not yet
mature.  I didn't really try the etpan-privacy plugin, as it conflicts
with the standard gpg plugins (it provides both GPG & S/MIME support),
but maybe it's more mature.  You can load & unload the plugins you want
or don't want in Configuration->Plugins.

> Grr - encryption must not be ready for prime time - it considered your
> message "encrypted" and consequently it wants to encrypt this reply
> (rather rude on mailing lists...)  :)

Odd... when I click reply to my earlier message, it doesn't seem to
consider it encrypted.  Did you double check the Account Privacy
settings to make sure it wasn't set to always encrypt messages?  I
can't think why it would want to encrypt the reply.

Did you try changing those options in thunderbird at all?  They didn't
seem to do anything for me, but they are supposed to work, and I'd be
interested in hearing if they work for someone other than myself.


Conway S. Smith

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Re: [gentoo-amd64] Sylpheed-claws GPG & S/MIME support

[Richard Freeman]

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Conway S. Smith wrote:
> Did you try changing those options in thunderbird at all?  They didn't
> seem to do anything for me, but they are supposed to work, and I'd be
> interested in hearing if they work for someone other than myself.
> 

Ok, it turns out that after changing this setting you have to clear out
your folder cache files - anything under .thunderbird ending in .msf.  A
bit of a pain, but once you do it they get rebuilt with correct
references-based threading.

Oh, and the threading doesn't work if you have a partial thread.
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Re: [gentoo-amd64] Sylpheed-claws GPG & S/MIME support

[Richard Freeman]

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Richard Freeman wrote:
> 
> Oh, and the threading doesn't work if you have a partial thread.

Ugh - hate to reply again on this off-topic thread, but it does work as
long as you have enough references to reconstruct things.
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